No!
What i am asking is how do you see the aircraft in the photos as a danger?
Is it that you see any aircraft ridge soaring above 600 ft South of Deadman`s Clough as a Danger?
Is it any aircraft ridge soaring South of Deadman`s Clough as a danger?
Can you also explain how you thought aircraft on the day were infringing ANO's?
Steve.
Steve
Gliders on S_N launch can reach 1400ft plus. In the event of a cable break the launch can terminate anywhere below that height, a paraglider with a depth of some 50ft provides a big obstruction to a glider with 50-60ft wingspan.
But you know all this so I am gobsmacked by your statement. You know the circuit patterns, you know about the dangers yet you seem to be encouraging reckless flying -- were you one of the pilots?
It seems pointless trying to reason with you on this forum.
Dear Dave.
Not personal.
I am just trying to investigate what the procedures are for your operation at Camp hill in a light West wind. For everyone.
So when you say the launch can terminate at any height. What you mean is above a certain height your pilots would always turn West? I assume drop their trailing cable immediately?
With a Cable brake At say 900 ft would your pilots turn East and go into a normal landing pattern?
With a cable brake, would your pilots ever turn East and go into their normal landing pattern?
Steve.
Hi Steve
Don't worry I have a thick skin........
In the event of a cable break they are trained to dump the cable ASAP so as not to drape the cable over the countryside. From there they could go either way, left or right even straight ahead to work things out.The worst situation is a hang up where the cable is caught on or draped over the glider. This is very rare but has happened - but we all know sods law!
With steel you got a feeling because of the weight, with dyneema being so light an inexperienced pilot may not realise for some time that the cable had broken especially if it went when the glider was close to a normal launch height.
Another problem is glider pilots cannot see down under the nose - paragliders and worse hang gliders cannot see up, it really is a bad mix of aircraft. If the gliding club is not flying no one has a problem. It is those days when the wind is very light and ot looks fine and we all want to soar. 2 weeks ago on the ground it was a very light westerly but get high around 35kts with strong wave up to the airway and more. I guess on Bradwell it was roterred out, over the airfield is was really rough at the south end but in the middle and north end it was fairly smooth so pilots were changing landing patterns to suit the conditions.
The club cannot set hard and fast rules pilots have to make their own decisions.
Regards,
Dave
Dear Dave.
I assume it is standard procedure for your pilots to pull the tow release twice?
What is the lowest height your pilots would turn West on to the ridge with a cable brake?
Can your dyneema cable be seen with the naked eye?
Would the winch-Man radio the pilot to confirm a cable brake?
Observation.
It is not good airman-ship to fly over another aircraft low or or under another aircraft high?
This is standard procedure, on a normal launch. In a winch launch the glider will be climbing nose high with no forward view. If the cable breaks then glide may be flying close to the stall. The pilots first action is nose down and regain flying speed then work out where to go safely. If there is time to think pull the release. There is no radio contact between the glider and the winch. The current Dyneema is 5mm light coloured and hard to see. You may hear it coming. Low cable breaks are normally straight ahead landings. Above 3-400ft the pilot would do short circuit. There are so many variables. If you are trying to suggest that this would be a safe height for para or hang -gliders to along the edge by the gliding club is wrong. the only way to follow you observation is a simple safe solution is to stay away. Another problem is that one possibly experienced pilot does it and the rest follow.
Come and try it!
Dave
Dear Dave.
Lets do a full amalgamation of the DSC and the DLGC then we can set what rules we want.
Until then I can`t see any pilots not flying where they choose.
I do see we have a role in educating pilots to the dangers they face and present to others.
I think we have explored the situation enough to give all pilots an insight into what the issues are. if they bother to look on this forum.
Thanks Dave.
Hi Steve
I am no longer a committee member of the gliding club and have not been for a few years now. One of the major problems with Bradwell is that DSC have no control of the edge. In practical operations I honestly do think that when Camphill is busy the mix of aircraft would be a safety hazard. I do not think it has been tried at a UK gliding side yet. I have been invited to fly at a German site in spring which is close to the WASSERKRUP where this happens I believe. It on my plans to visit.
Cheers
Dave